I might have misunderstood this but is Android really trying to push this as tracking as a privacy upgrade, simply because it let’s us choose which of our interests we want advertisers to have access to?

        • delirious_owl@discuss.online
          3·
          9 months ago

          Obviously by “google” were talking about proprietary blobs.

          For example TOTP is great. There’s no issue with the fact that it was developed by Google. Same with AOSP.

          Any ROM doesn’t have Google Play Services by default and therefore its google free in all the ways that matter

          • Pantherina@feddit.de
            21·
            9 months ago

            No some OS preinstall microG. Because only if the core is finished you can hash and sign it, if the user flashes some apps afterwards that doesnt work.

            Btw ROM is read only memory, a tiny part of the firmware

            • Fisch@lemmy.ml
              2·
              9 months ago

              MicroG is open source tho and only talks to Google if you explicitely activate it

              • Pantherina@feddit.de
                11·
                9 months ago

                No its not. They download Google Binaries which run as system apps and have privileged access.

                They practice badness enumeration in some form, while their permission model (only activating what is needed) is a better approach but incomplete.

                Any app that relies on Play has those libraries implemented, so they could show ads etc. on their own. But with microG they have a component with privileged system access, in contrast to sandboxed play where no component is privileged.

          • Pantherina@feddit.de
            12·
            9 months ago

            Which is even less degoogles as it preinstalls microG which is official Google binaries, running as a system app with permission to critical system infos and basically all your stuff.

            See my other comments.

    • Zetta@mander.xyz
      134·
      9 months ago

      ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I wish but switching to Apple would be just as bad and I would want to die being forced to use their fisher price software for the tech illiterate.

      Soon though, in the next 5 years I think Linux phones (I know Android is Linux, you know what I mean) will be in a good state. So hopefully I can switch soonish

      • michael_palmer@lemmy.sdf.org
        5·
        9 months ago

        Google and SOC vendors are trying their best to stop developing of Linux phones. That’s why available Linux phones use 10 year old chipsets.

        • Bloodyhog@lemmy.world
          1·
          9 months ago

          Lets be frank, the main reason is that only like 1% of the market has an articulated preference towards free software and privacy. No money to be made equals no product in our cruel world. And of course FOSS, even if it is free to a user (as in you do not have to pay to use it. You do need to spend your time and resources to learn it though, and that is not free already), is by no means free to develop. The time spent on it by devs has to be compensated somehow, enthusiasm is unfortunately not the only fuel our bodies need. And then, for phones, the hardware required is not free as well. And then we need a manufacturer, who would be much more interested in making a billion Android phones than a million of a niche product.

          Does Google actively try to stop development of the alternatives? Unlikely, because they don’t have to. They do not make it easier of course, why would they. And they do buy out everything they can, because they can use it to improve their products.

          I do not see a good way out of this loop for now. Do you?

      • The_v@lemmy.world
        4·
        9 months ago

        I am waiting for the same thing. The amount of shit you have to disable, block, or unistall on android is getting ridiculous. It’s getting really old.

        Most of the new “features” that either apple or google add anymore are absolute trash. I am constantly having to go through the settings and disable shit.

        The stock android is so full of non-romovable crap that a launcher is required anymore.

        It’s the same for windows, win11 is only usable with a launcher like startallback.

        • Pantherina@feddit.de
          1·
          9 months ago

          Dont wait, just get a Pixel 6a-8 and install GrapheneOS.

          (8 is expensive but will last 7+ years with extended GrapheneOS updates)

          • ridethisbike@lemmy.world
            1·
            9 months ago

            What do you use in place of GApps? F-droid?

            Also, what’s the flashing process like these days? Does it still wipe everything or is there a way to save all the personal stuff?

            • Pantherina@feddit.de
              1·
              9 months ago

              Just check grapheneos.org

              They have only a minimal appstore preinstalled, which they use for their own apps. It is the best there is with full background updates etc. Every store could do this if they used modern libraries.

              You have Vanadium preinstalled, from which you can install “F-Droid Basic” (the modern client), or Aurorastore, or accrescent, obtainium etc.

              Their own solution is sandboxed google play, installed as regular user apps with way more restricted permissions and an opt-in method (only dedicated calls are allowed) in contrast to the extremely privileged microG or even “GAPPS” which can do everything (and in the place of microG having selected things removed, badness enumeration while still using proprietary Google code).

              GrapheneOS is basically Android done right, play services etc. work, you can install all Google apps from the playstore, not as system apps, if you wanted to. (wallet and others are exceptions as they require a Google certified OS).

        • Pantherina@feddit.de
          21·
          9 months ago

          Calyx is way worse than Graphene. Only use it if your device is not supported by GrapheneOS > DivestOS.

          And afaik Calyx doesnt even support many phones lol. On GrapheneOS this is actually due to missing security, which Calyx doesnt even use.

      • delirious_owl@discuss.online
        2·
        9 months ago

        I dont think they’re saying to use Apple. I read that as “Use Android without Google” … Which is actually easier than using Android with Google if you install the OS yourself.

    • toastal@lemmy.ml
      9·
      9 months ago

      Fuck banking institutions & their apps. We are seeing them eliminate online banking now & cash is slowly not being accepted by vendors & in-person experiences are worse—instead everything is siloed to only Android or iOS & disallow any sort of modifications to your device with all these attestation assertions. If a user wanted to ditch their phone, go Linux, use an unGoogled phone, or get a dumbphone, etc. they will be disconnected from the banking network—to which most users would view as an immediate nonstarter. Apple is just a different data-collecting advertising business.

      • boomzilla@programming.dev
        4·
        8 months ago

        The browser login of my bank needs a separate application that’s windows only or an app. The Java(!) application Jameica saved my ass for the 6 years I’m on Linux now. It can manage multiple accounts. It offers statistics, saves all the transfers, deposits and balances ad infinitum on your disk, is searchable and has templates and schedules for transfers.

        The protocol my bank uses is FinTS, I think. I’m logging in via a certificate file and a password.

        I don’t want to use an app, cause I trust my cutting edge Linux (Kernel 6.7.6) a lot more than my possibly malicious app riddled outdated android.

      • delirious_owl@discuss.online
        53·
        9 months ago

        In many places its illegal to not accept cash. Report any businesses and if its legal in your area, donate to your local privacy lobbiest NGO and contact your representative.

        • kungen@feddit.nu
          3·
          9 months ago

          In many places its illegal to not accept cash.

          Where? I can’t think of many places where that’d be true.

    • JohnDClay@sh.itjust.works
      125·
      9 months ago

      Apple is terrible right to repair, and lineage has a bunch of weird bugs, so I’m kinda stuck with it

      • N4CHEM@lemmy.ml
        93·
        9 months ago

        Which bugs have you found in LineageOS? There’s quite a big community behind it, so maybe you can find some help. There are also other LineageOS-based ROMs worth checking: CalyxOS, DivestOS, iodéOS, /e/OS.

      • Pantherina@feddit.de
        58·
        9 months ago

        GrapheneOS is the only good Option. Calyx and /e/ are both just LineageOS forks with incomplete or even insecure additions

      • MigratingtoLemmy@lemmy.world
        85·
        9 months ago

        DeGoogle your Android ROM/use a custom ROM. What exactly was so hard to understand in that comment that made you want to switch to a feature-phone?

          • Pantherina@feddit.de
            3·
            9 months ago

            Thats how you do it with GrapheneOS. Buy a pixel, take like 30min to install the OS, install F-Droid Basic and sandboxed Play and get your apps.

            Degoogling Android is not possible, and LineageOS and other more difficult to install Androids are less secure.

            GrapheneOS has a graphical installer, you just need a Laptop (Windows, Linux, Mac), a Chromebook or another Android phone and a USB cable, thats it. You can literally install it from one phone (using some variant of Chromium like Chrome, Cromite, Brave etc.) By opening a website and clicking 4 buttons.

          • mxl@lemm.ee
            102·
            9 months ago

            You mean the one who stepped down like half a year ago? Also GOS is not the work of a single person, you know…

              • mxl@lemm.ee
                1·
                9 months ago

                You’re right he’s still committing, however it’s easily verifiable he’s not the only one. Still I’ll give you that, since it seems Micay is quite active. I guess I am a “sheep that blindly trusts”, since I don’t have the skills to audit the code in this case. I will assume you are not such a sheep (otherwise why would you accuse someone else of being so?), so would you please enlighten me on the verifications you’ve done or the evidence you’ve found that makes you not trust the GOS project? On top of that. What do you trust for a mobile OS?

      • OrangeCorvus@lemmy.worldEnglish
        192·
        9 months ago

        ios is not really privacy friendly. It’s more the result of an amazing PR campaign. That plus the fact that Apple wasn’t really in the ad game but now it is slowly changing. In reality you are giving your data to Apple. You will say, yeah but Apple is ok, of course they are because they have great marketing. Google doesn’t and Google = privacy nightmare, which is also true.

        • Pantherina@feddit.de
          32·
          9 months ago

          IOS being private is such a horrible lie. Techlore is really annoying with those subtle ads, even though they also often cover GrapheneOS.

          If Apple wants your shit, with any of their OS you are theirs. You are not private if you need to rely on the mercy of Big Brother to not steal your stuff

      • RogueBanana@lemmy.zipEnglish
        161·
        9 months ago

        Its funny that I was forced to buy a google pixel just to avoid google. Wish more companies here allow people to unlock bootloader on the mobile they own.